Slots to California Racetracks?

[pmd62ndst]

If you live in California, you've probably seen the advertisement about how Indian Casinos generated over $6 billion in revenue last year and virtually pay no taxes which would have equated to nearly $2 billion in taxes.

There's an initiative called "Fair Share" where Indian Casinos would have to pay taxes or else "suffer the consequences". This ballot initiative is >heavily< backed by Magna which is what caught my eye.

After reading the fine print, it seems that if Indian Casinos don't pay taxes, the consequences will allow other non-Indian Casinos to operate slot machines and thus pay taxes. Since Magna is lobbying hard for this one, seems like they would be first in line.

This initiative is cleverly disguised as a way for the weiry California taxpayer to get more money into the budget deficit but it really is about getting slot machines to California Race Tracks.

I've seen this thread in the past for other states but didn't read them because I really wasn't interested. Now, I am interested because this is in my own backyard.

We've got a long way to November and this initiative hasn't even qualified for the ballot yet but I still want to know what others who have seen this happen to their racetracks think about it.

PMD

[Blackgold]

Those plants that have slots have an advantage over those that don't.

But allowing slots at racetracks, gambling boats on every available pond (there was a proposal once to put one in the water at now defunct Garden State) and casinos everwhere they can be voted in (not to mention lotteries) only allows the country to avoid, for a while longer, the ineveitable. . . we have to be more efficient in our management. . .in management of product. . . in management of customers and in management of funds.

So CA tracks gets slots. . . will customer service improve? Will Magna still have more money to wreak havoc on the fan? Will it solve CA's incomprehensible workerman's comp policies?

Fairgrounds got slots voted in last fall. They have had video poker for ten years before that and mismanaged the funds, that's whey they went CH11.

Every state wants a lottery and those that get it promises it will go to teachers and education, yet it rarely does.

While we are at it, why not legalize sports betting? At least the astute capper has a chance to make a living at it? How many people have an advantage at slots?

We install negative expectation games like lotteries and slots and in effect tax the less educated or emotionally retarded. . .and then we pay more in government funds to bail out the same partons or worse, house them in an institution or a jail.

No doubt, those tracks that have slots are at an advantage over those that don't have them. But once everyone gets them, will we see any of the real management problems get solved or will we see more unbelivable bad treatment because now they can bloat their payrolls even more with inefficient and ineffective managers.

[superfecta]

since the injuns already are making money and not paying the state anything,what does it matter if the state gets a cut that it will squander?A piece of the pie is better than none at all.Unless the state can recind the ability of the tribes to operate,there is not much that change the fact the machines are in Cali.
Much of the same was done here in Ok. this year.Finally the tracks can compete somewhat with the tribes,and the tribes will pay some money to the state.Gambling is here,thats a fact.But the MWC dumass Forrest Claunch (Gumps Brother) Is passing a petition to repeal the bill and get a vote of the people to make it legal to have machines at the track.Says its bad that the state will make money from gambling.But if the tracks don't get machines,the state won't get any money,the indian racinos will still exist and the state will still piss money off that it doesn't have.But forrest will be able to say he stood in the way of gaming.:rolleyes:

[Hosshead]

If this law in Ca. is passed, I think it will REALLY hurt the Indian Casinos. People now drive long distances from the L.A. area to San Diego and Palm Springs areas just to gamble. If all they have to do is go to the nearest track....

I've never liked the idea of indian casinos not paying taxes, but on the other hand I hate to be on the side of Magna about anything. But the indian casinos have a lot of money, and we'll probably be inundated with T.V. commercials about the poor indians. They desperately don't want people to gamble anyplace else than indian casinos. They're going to fight for this one. It's the Indian Alamo !!

[socantra]

My information is that Forrest Claunch is just trying to deliver on congressman Tom Cole's elction promise. Its a bit off topic, but I can't resist the story.....

Election night 2002, a longtime democratic party operative roared by the house piss drunk. He was raving about the fact that Bill Anatubby, principal chief of the Chickasaw nation had sold a block of votes to republican congressional candidate Tom Cole for a briefcase full of cash and a promise to keep the state from agreeing to a tribal gaming compact.

The tribes stand to make more money with the compact, but Anatubby wasn't real crazy about the new accounting regulations that would come with it. Cole figured it was a safe promise, but then the democrats snuck in and captured the governors office....

Can't swear to the accuracy of the story, but my drunken friend was sure mad. He kept raving about "Why the hell wouldn't that damn Anatubby call his friends first?"

socantra....

[garyoz]

I live far from CA, but I do try to follow their state politics for entertainment purposes. I am skeptical such a referendum will do much. I was under the impression that the Indian Casinos had pretty much a lock on the state Democratic Party through campaign contributions. Certainly was alot of controversy about the Indian Tribe contributions to Gray Davis (how quickly the boring and inept fade from memory). Also I remember hearing that Senator Feinstein's son is involved in Tribal Casino developments. I think it would be very difficult to get gaming legislation through Sacramento.

Speaking of the inept, I continue to be amazed at Magna's lack of due diligence and fundamental lack of understanding (not even a misunderstanding) of the trends in the racing industry before their acquisition binge during the last five years. Trying to secure fundamental changes in a industry on a state by state basis after the acquisitions is a high risk proposition. If Stronach weren't majority shareholder he and his revolving door team of management would be out the door.

BTW, I've been a player and racing fan for more than 40 years. I think that racinos are a great benefit to the players. Delaware, the Louisiana Tracks (except FG) MNR, and the others provide nice purses and a varied menu for handicapping and playing.

[delayjf]

I don't know why the Gov (state) doesn't go into the Casino business. That way they'd get most of the money not just 25%.

I don't know how long the State Legislatures can avoid measures such as the above. To raise the money they need, they'll have to do something. Raising the car tax and or property tax will get you thrown out of office fast, Indian Casino campaign contributions notwithstanding.

[garyoz]

Nationally, more incumbents die in office than are defeated in an election. The great American Electorate likes to pull the lever for a name they know (plus Gerrymandering, etc.). Perhaps, slots are inevitable, but each year any project is delayed represents great cash flow for the Native American casinos and an even greater opportunity for politicians to shake them down.

[superfecta]

Originally posted by socantra
My information is that Forrest Claunch is just trying to deliver on congressman Tom Cole's elction promise. Its a bit off topic, but I can't resist the story.....

Election night 2002, a longtime democratic party operative roared by the house piss drunk. He was raving about the fact that Bill Anatubby, principal chief of the Chickasaw nation had sold a block of votes to republican congressional candidate Tom Cole for a briefcase full of cash and a promise to keep the state from agreeing to a tribal gaming compact.

The tribes stand to make more money with the compact, but Anatubby wasn't real crazy about the new accounting regulations that would come with it. Cole figured it was a safe promise, but then the democrats snuck in and captured the governors office....

Can't swear to the accuracy of the story, but my drunken friend was sure mad. He kept raving about "Why the hell wouldn't that damn Anatubby call his friends first?"

socantra.... Its called covering the bases:).If the story is true,Anatubby was playing both sides.As for the story being true,I would'nt doubt it.Our legislature and officials is a mix of amazingly sneaky and /or stupid people.Seems like thats it,no in between.Yesterday I read about the bill that would make it illegal to play porn on the tv in your car because someone else driving down the road would be able to see it.Why do we need to waste time on a law like this?I would think it would be covered in laws dealing with indecency already.Ahh,Im getting way off(in topic):eek: