Owning vs Betting.

[Stillriledup]

Here's a hypothetical. You're given a million dollars and there are 2 things you can do with that money. #1 is that you can use it to wager. You have a million dollar bankroll to start. You can bet anything you want, you can bet any track any amount as many days as you want. #2 is owning. You can claim horses or purchase horses privately, but you can't bet, you can just own.

The caveat is this. At the end of 2 years, you pay back the million and keep whatever you have left over. If you have less than 1 million, you just pay back all of the money you have in your ADW account and the losses are forgiven, but you have 0 profit. If you choose horse owning, every horse you own gets sold at an auction at the end of 2 years and same rules apply, you get to keep anything you have over 1 million and you pay the original stake back after the entire stable is liquidated.




Also, you can stipulate if you would make a different choice depending on size of rebate, whether its a big rebate, moderate rebate or no rebate.

In other words, you might choose the wagering part if you got a moderate rebate or big rebate, but choose the owning part if you got no rebate.

[lamboguy]

i have done both, made and lost doing both recently. from what i see there are a lot more people in the game that know what they are doing when they buy and train horses. horses that used to cost at a sale $10,000 are selling for $30,000. by the time that horse has his first race that horse now cost $50,000. there are to many of them that go backwards to make money in that game today.

as far as claiming a horse, i really have no clue. i see there are some big owners out there that have lots of horses. David Jacobson's owners must be doing well, along with Midwest Thoroughbred Corporation are big and they seem to win often as well. there are plenty more similar to these guys as well.

as far as betting goes, for arguments sake, lets say i spend a million buying and training horses and the same betting them during a year. i personally do better at betting on them. maybe in my case owning and betting went hand in hand. that's probably why i lost last year, i backed off buying horses for the first time. this year i am managing horses for other people, that might help my betting hopefully.

[sjk]

I have also done both. For me I have more confidence that over a 2 year period I would be money ahead betting. Two years of betting would be thousands of races and for those who have the ability to be long term winners that is plenty of time to get to stable results.

It is pretty easy to spend a million on horses and come up with almost nothing with residual value. Hopefully you would have some fun and collect some pictures.

I am not sure that I have got back to even after 20 years of owning horses but if I have it is only because of getting a great price at auction for our last mare.

[Mineshaft]

Give me owning any day of the week.

[cosmicway]

In my new Holywood scenario, gala performence sometime next autumn, rich uncle dies in Africa and leaves a ten billion dollar fortune to a distant nephew who did n't even know of the uncle's existence.
The condition is that the nephew will make wild sex to 5 specified gorgeous sexy milfs, who are not however known for their predilection of hanky-pankying around - he has to talk them into it.
He has two years to accomplish the task and a firm of lawyers equipped with all the modern technological gadgets is overseeing the process to make sure that fair play is observed. So for example he is not allowed to offer 1 billion to each of those women, to make them agree.
If he loses the bet then the fortune goes to a cats home.

The continuation on your screens ...

[therussmeister]

Give me owning any day of the week.
Give me betting any two years of the millennium.

[davew]

I think the answer would depend on if the person has big time aspirations to be a bigtime bettor or bigtime owner.

I would go with the bankroll (as long as I could use it for related expenses like occasionally travelling to the tracks to view races).

[cosmicway]

One million dollars is one club sandwitch and a coke everyday at the Hilton lounge for one year.

[5k-claim]

If you choose horse owning, every horse you own gets sold at an auction at the end of 2 years and same rules apply, you get to keep anything you have over 1 million and you pay the original stake back after the entire stable is liquidated. I would take $1M worth of really nice weanlings. Spread out over about 7-8 of them.

In your scenario, they would be sold back at auction as 2 year-olds. That would be pretty exciting.

But that is if your scenario just means one big sale at the end of the 2 year period. If your scenario allows for buying and selling throughout that period then I would not limit myself to just weanling purchases. I would split it with some yearlings. (I don't want yearlings that I can't sell until they are 3 year-olds.)

.

[Robert Fischer]

Betting.

In a couple months I would own some profitable claimers as well.

[Shemp Howard]

I'd give the #1MM to a partnership and then sit back and wait for the monthly checks to roll in.

You only live once, right?

[cosmicway]

Seriously the thing to do is both.
With some horses you buy you control races and milk the bet plus prize money plus buy-sell.
The task is to keep expenses down and also to make them feel respect for you.
Your friends, besides money, are name dropping and some beautiful lady companions.

[thaskalos]

A million dollars would be too much of a bankroll for me in today's game. IMO, the wagering pools do not justify wagers of this magnitude...at least not the way I play.

So...I would do both.

I would use $200,000 as my betting bankroll...and then use the other $800,000 to get me some Pennsylvania-breds...and stable them at Parx.

[therussmeister]

A million dollars would be too much of a bankroll for me in today's game. IMO, the wagering pools do not justify wagers of this magnitude...at least not the way I play.

So...I would do both.

I would use $200,000 as my betting bankroll...and then use the other $800,000 to get me some Pennsylvania-breds...and stable them at Parx.
I could justify at least a 1.5 million bankroll for the way I play... or would play with 1.5 million.

[shank]

I've had it explained to me that owning horses is near a 50% take game. I'd have to vote for wagering. Without a rebate 95% would be net losers.

[thespaah]

Here's a hypothetical. You're given a million dollars and there are 2 things you can do with that money. #1 is that you can use it to wager. You have a million dollar bankroll to start. You can bet anything you want, you can bet any track any amount as many days as you want. #2 is owning. You can claim horses or purchase horses privately, but you can't bet, you can just own.

The caveat is this. At the end of 2 years, you pay back the million and keep whatever you have left over. If you have less than 1 million, you just pay back all of the money you have in your ADW account and the losses are forgiven, but you have 0 profit. If you choose horse owning, every horse you own gets sold at an auction at the end of 2 years and same rules apply, you get to keep anything you have over 1 million and you pay the original stake back after the entire stable is liquidated.




Also, you can stipulate if you would make a different choice depending on size of rebate, whether its a big rebate, moderate rebate or no rebate.

In other words, you might choose the wagering part if you got a moderate rebate or big rebate, but choose the owning part if you got no rebate.
Is one of the conditions that one must spend or wager the entire amount?

[Stillriledup]

Is one of the conditions that one must spend or wager the entire amount?

No, you can bet as much or as little as you want. Same with the owning. You can theoretically keep 980k in the owning account, make one claim for 20k and let that ride it out. You can stop whenever you want to "cash out".

[thespaah]

No, you can bet as much or as little as you want. Same with the owning. You can theoretically keep 980k in the owning account, make one claim for 20k and let that ride it out. You can stop whenever you want to "cash out".
Then I am an owner.
As it would be possible to take some of the money and invest it in a growth or income vehicle.
I would probably buy two or three weanlings. Get them broken and trained. Then put them in a yearling sale. Then do it again.
That should realize a pretty significant profit.
Of course the horses would be insured in case of anything bad happening.

[classhandicapper]

I think I 'd take a crack at buying a bunch of well bred fillies. There's less of a chance of a major score with fillies, but more of a chance of getting some kind of positive return on each while still winning some prestigious races that would give you the thrill of a lifetime. I already know there's no bankroll in the world that's going to get me to handicap enough races or bet enough per race to throw millions through the windows these days.