AQI David Jacobsen Show

[RunForTheRoses]

Not good at all today. I guess what you do is wait until he's particularly overbet and find value but c'mon? He's that much better than the other trainers?
Trying to choose Pick 4s and the man is around every corner.

[jk3521]

He broke some kind of trainer record for the year so I think he will back off a little the last 2 days.give someone else a chance. :eek:

[jk3521]

The greedy S.O.B wins 2 today :mad:

[Stillriledup]

He's created a situation where the "human element" is too much of a factor in the handicapping. It's not horse racing, its trainer racing. Now, for some, this may be exactly what you are all looking for, a situation where a human being and his presence in the races trumps anything you see on replays or on the PPs.

Its not for me, but you know, to each his own.

[sammy the sage]

Interesting...nm...

[nijinski]

He may have to change his ways ! Very quickly !

Lot's of folks upset about Torque , he's not fully to blame IMO but this
is not going to go down quietly .

[taxicab]

He may have to change his ways ! Very quickly !

Lot's of folks upset about Torque , he's not fully to blame IMO but this
is not going to go down quietly .



I'm afraid to ask.
What is the story.

[nijinski]

[QUOTE=taxicab]I'm afraid to ask.
What is the story.[/QUOTE

He is being dissected at this moment . Photos of Toque are showing up in the social media and he was said to have been at the New Holland auction.
Unfortunately for DJ he last dropped him at Suffolk and it was a DNF .
They are trying to locate the horse as he was bailed but it's said he was not in good shape and may not have survived .

Steve Zorn and Maggi Moss have tweets and FB dialogue if you are
interested . Many are asking for NYRA to deal with him .

I don't expect any steep drop downs right now .

[nijinski]

He may have to change his ways ! Very quickly !

Lot's of folks upset about Torque , he's not fully to blame IMO but this
is not going to go down quietly .
BTW my bad there is no r It is Toque !

[FantasticDan]

Ah shit, I was (am) a fan of Toque. Watched him race at Finger Lakes many times.. :mad:

[taxicab]

Thanks.
I kind of figured it was something like that.
Jacobsen is a creep,no getting around it.
Asmussen,Hollendorfer among others have slaughterhouse histories.
Either you have compassion for animals or you don't.
Obviously some of the biggest names in horse racing don't.

[nijinski]

Thanks.
I kind of figured it was something like that.
Jacobsen is a creep,no getting around it.
Asmussen,Hollendorfer among others have slaughterhouse histories.
Either you have compassion for animals or you don't.
Obviously some of the biggest names in horse racing don't.

I believe NYTHA has been working with retirement programs and this is
extremely needed and a classy move . :ThmbUp: It needs to be implemented at all tracks ad any trainers, owners who won't comply
should not be on the grounds .

[nijinski]

Ah shit, I was (am) a fan of Toque. Watched him race at Finger Lakes many times.. :mad:
Yes he did well there .

[jk3521]

Incredible!! friday entries show Jacobson with only one race with horses entered, saturday I only counted 3 races with horses entered ! The Heat must be on :mad:

[nijinski]

Someones opinion in a blog
http://businessofracing.blogspot.com/2014/01/some-thoughts-on-end-of-road.html

[PressThePace]

Someones opinion in a blog
http://businessofracing.blogspot.com/2014/01/some-thoughts-on-end-of-road.html

Informative...and indicative of what goes on in this "game".

[nijinski]

Informative...and indicative of what goes on in this "game".

It goes on unfortunately but there are very many good people too !

[Cholly]

It had never occurred to me that there were business arrangements like the one described in Zorn's blog. One result is that in this business model no vet bills get passed on to the Owner for payment--no one sees the vet bill except Jacobsen and his vet.

Not accusing...just saying.

[jk3521]

The beginning of the end for Mr Jacobson :mad:

[Stillriledup]

I would guess that at least a handful of horses in the last 6 months trained by Jacobson have shipped to rock bottom classes at Laurel, Suffolk and FL after being claimed at a NYRA track for at least 15k. This is common practice for this barn.

[westny]

It had never occurred to me that there were business arrangements like the one described in Zorn's blog. One result is that in this business model no vet bills get passed on to the Owner for payment--no one sees the vet bill except Jacobsen and his vet.

Not accusing...just saying.

Good point.

Also, Jacobsen has no cash outlay. The "50 person" syndicate buys the horse for ex., 30k. Jacobsen gets 65% of the purse if/when the horse races. That is why Jacobsen races the same horses every few days and drops them until...

If they get claimed for less than the ex, 30k purchase price, Jacobsen has no capital loss. So, Jacobsen gets 65% of purses and he controls whatever he decides to spend on "horse/stable costs". What do the syndicate " 50 owners" get out of this deal?

[Robert Fischer]

Reading through this thread from start-to-finish, and I can't tell if the axe to grind is for Jacobson's success, or for his alleged practices.

[jk3521]

He might have had some idea the it wouldn't be too long before the jig was up. He really seemed to have stepped up the program the last 3 months. Of course the quality of racing is lower this time of year ,so more opportunities.

[RunForTheRoses]

Reading through this thread from start-to-finish, and I can't tell if the axe to grind is for Jacobson's success, or for his alleged practices.

Its probably a little of both as people don't like to see a big success, the leading NY Trainer of 2013, act like a cruel SOB. If he was struggling to get by I think enmity would still be there, just not on this scale.

[JustRalph]

These numbers can't be right? How does the syndicate survive? Does the math actually work?

[Mineshaft]

These numbers can't be right? How does the syndicate survive? Does the math actually work?




No owner will survive when they give the trainer 65-70% of the purse plus pay for the horse and then get half there money back on the claim when the horse is dropped in half. All of this is hear say and until a member of Drawing Away comes on hear and tells us actually what the deal is I think we are guessing as to whats happening with this stable.

[nijinski]

No owner will survive when they give the trainer 65-70% of the purse plus pay for the horse and then get half there money back on the claim when the horse is dropped in half. All of this is hear say and until a member of Drawing Away comes on hear and tells us actually what the deal is I think we are guessing as to whats happening with this stable.
The owner purchases the horse according to the website so there is no other expense .

[FantasticDan]

Jacobson absolved of wrongdoing, Toque was sick and euthanized:

http://www.drf.com/news/jacobson-absolved-wrongdoing-racehorse-found-slaughterhouse

[JustRalph]

Jacobson absolved of wrongdoing, Toque was sick and euthanized:

http://www.drf.com/news/jacobson-absolved-wrongdoing-racehorse-found-slaughterhouse

After reading that earlier today, I couldn't help but wonder what the horse was exposed to in a kill pen?

absolution is a fleeting observation if you ask me.

[Mineshaft]

The owner purchases the horse according to the website so there is no other expense .





Purchases the horse for 25K drops to 12.5K and gets claimed. They lose 12.5K on the claim and only get a 1/3 of the purse. If this is the case they would be out of business but they are still in business which makes me believe something aint right about this deal.

[Stillriledup]

Jacobson absolved of wrongdoing, Toque was sick and euthanized:

http://www.drf.com/news/jacobson-absolved-wrongdoing-racehorse-found-slaughterhouse

Phew, this is good news, after all, where would this game be without David Jacobson. I'm not sure i'd be able to sleep at night if the Jacobson's, Bafferts and Kirk Ziadie's of the world suddenly left the game. I know my handicapping would suffer greatly if the "human element" was taken out of the handicapping process and i was forced (GULP!) to handicap HORSES and not people. You see folks, i feel that horse racing is really people racing in disguise with the horses as a bit player...after all, if you read Bill Dwyre from the LA Times, its all about Baffert and the humans....forget the horses, people go to the track to see Baffert and other human "stars" and without them, according to Dwyre, the game would tank.

Thank god Jacobson won't be going anywhere anytime soon!!!

[nijinski]

Purchases the horse for 25K drops to 12.5K and gets claimed. They lose 12.5K on the claim and only get a 1/3 of the purse. If this is the case they would be out of business but they are still in business which makes me believe something aint right about this deal.

I'm sure Zorn will be corrected if wrong but it's been out there before that blog and I haven't heard any different .

[nijinski]

Jacobson absolved of wrongdoing, Toque was sick and euthanized:

http://www.drf.com/news/jacobson-absolved-wrongdoing-racehorse-found-slaughterhouse

After purchasing Toque for 25,000 , drops him out of town for 5,000
horse is eased . Gives him to this friend in good health???? Doubt it .

[BombsAway Bob]

Reading through this thread from start-to-finish, and I can't tell if the axe to grind is for Jacobson's success, or for his alleged practices.
when you put his "practices" together, the Axe should be sharpened.
From Greg Jones~ www.twitter.com/Wookie318
http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1rvkq83

[jk3521]

http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1rvkq83

Wow his record is scary. I know a lot of trainers may be responsible for these kind of actions, but this has been on a larger scale than most.

[Rise Over Run]

No owner will survive when they give the trainer 65-70% of the purse plus pay for the horse and then get half there money back on the claim when the horse is dropped in half. All of this is hear say and until a member of Drawing Away comes on hear and tells us actually what the deal is I think we are guessing as to whats happening with this stable.
This is exactly how it works. Some claims work out well, some don't. I'm not involved in Drawing Away, but I was involved in similar partnerships in WV and PA several years ago.

[Tom]

when you put his "practices" together, the Axe should be sharpened.
From Greg Jones~ www.twitter.com/Wookie318
http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1rvkq83

Seems the Three Blind Mice run racing.
Wonder if the officials still think the world is flat?

[VeryOldMan]

when you put his "practices" together, the Axe should be sharpened.
From Greg Jones~ www.twitter.com/Wookie318
http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1rvkq83

Amen.

For those who have a Facebook account, it's worth checking out what Maggi Moss has been writing about Toque and more generally about Jacobson/Drawing Away. She's one of the "good guys" on the rescue front, and has been on the warpath. Here's the link - I don't think it will get you through to her page unless you sign into your own account:

https://www.facebook.com/maggi.moss.5?fref=ts

[Mineshaft]

This is exactly how it works. Some claims work out well, some don't. I'm not involved in Drawing Away, but I was involved in similar partnerships in WV and PA several years ago.



So the trainer gets 65%of the purse? Hard to believe the owners are making money

[Horseplayersbet.com]

So the trainer gets 65%of the purse? Hard to believe the owners are making money
If a horse makes 60k for the year (which is a pretty good year), without a deal like this, about 20% goes towards jockey and trainer percentages, and the cost of training for a year including vet bills, shipping, etc. might be as high as 35k or more in certain jurisdictions. This leaves the owner with a 13k profit, which is around 20% of the total purses. Under this deal, the owner gets around 20k for the year if the deal reported is correct.

[Rise Over Run]

So the trainer gets 65%of the purse? Hard to believe the owners are making money

Even with DJs "success", I doubt the majority of them are making money. Though I imagine many of the syndicate partners aren't in it to get rich, or even break even. Partners are getting a piece of relatively high-price claimers for a few thousand dollars where there is no risk beyond the initial cash outlay. For many, I imagine the action and thrill of the game with ownership is priceless.

[Mineshaft]

I dont follow Jacobsen or NY racing at all so I don't know how many horses hes claiming and dumping right off the bat. If hes not dumping then yes I imagine owners are making some money. But if hes dropping the horse in half 1st off the claim then I would think they are losing money. If Drawing Away stable is still in the game then I assume they are making money but how much?


Im going to have to follow Jacobsen and his claims for the next month.

[Mineshaft]

they even have a website. It says a one time fee with no expenses. Wonder what that one time fee is?

[Rise Over Run]

they even have a website. It says a one time fee with no expenses. Wonder what that one time fee is?
15% on top of what the original horse is claimed for. It's in the FAQ section.

[Mineshaft]

15% on top of what the original horse is claimed for. It's in the FAQ section.



So if they claim one for 50K I have to pay them 50K plus 15% or is it 15% of 50K which comes out to $7500?

[VeryOldMan]

So if they claim one for 50K I have to pay them 50K plus 15% or is it 15% of 50K which comes out to $7500?
Here's the quote from the FAQ that ROR was referring to:

The cost of owning a racehorse with Drawing Away Stable is the percentage you own of the claiming price of the horse plus 15%. A horse claimed for $50,000 would have a cost for a 10% share of $5,750. There would never be any additional costs.

[jk3521]

Of course it's not gonna happen , but wouldn't it be something if Jacobson answered his critics!

[Stillriledup]

This thread needs to start being less about Toque and that individual situation and more about all the horses that Jacobson claimed at NYRA tracks and raced at Suffolk, Finger Lakes and Laurel.

Maybe if someone has the time, they can go back 1 year and look up every horse Jacobson claimed, and research the whereabouts of all these horses today. Every single one of them. I know i've seen plenty of his horses claimed for 15, 20 and higher, running at lower rung tracks for 5k, Toque isnt the only one.

[cj]

This thread needs to start being less about Toque and that individual situation and more about all the horses that Jacobson claimed at NYRA tracks and raced at Suffolk, Finger Lakes and Laurel.

Maybe if someone has the time, they can go back 1 year and look up every horse Jacobson claimed, and research the whereabouts of all these horses today. Every single one of them. I know i've seen plenty of his horses claimed for 15, 20 and higher, running at lower rung tracks for 5k, Toque isnt the only one.

You have time, just take a break from posting.

[Mineshaft]

You have time, just take a break from posting.





LMAO.... that's a good one CJ

[jk3521]

This thread needs to start being less about Toque and that individual situation and more about all the horses that Jacobson claimed at NYRA tracks and raced at Suffolk, Finger Lakes and Laurel.

Maybe if someone has the time, they can go back 1 year and look up every horse Jacobson claimed, and research the whereabouts of all these horses today. Every single one of them. I know i've seen plenty of his horses claimed for 15, 20 and higher, running at lower rung tracks for 5k, Toque isnt the only one.


Didn't you read this?http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1rvkq83

[westny]

So the trainer gets 65%of the purse? Hard to believe the owners are making money

Clearly, you have never seen a Jacobsen horse in the
winners circle". There are "50 owners" there. You seem to cling to the musguided belief "owners" in these cheap syndicates :eek: "make money". Likely, 90% don't. But they get a picture in the winners circle and "tell" everyone they "own" a race horse.

Sole owner's of million dollar race horses lose alot of money, and they race for 6 figures or more. How much money you think a 10% owner of a 20k claiming horse is going to "make"? $0

[Mineshaft]

Clearly, you have never seen a Jacobsen horse in the
winners circle". There are "50 owners" there. You seem to cling to the musguided belief "owners" in these cheap syndicates :eek: "make money". Likely, 90% don't. But they get a picture in the winners circle and "tell" everyone they "own" a race horse.

Sole owner's of million dollar race horses lose alot of money, and they race for 6 figures or more. How much money you think a 10% owner of a 20k claiming horse is going to "make"? $0





Didn't I just say in an earlier thread I don't follow Jacobson or NY racing? So to you answer your question NO ive never seen a Jacobson horse in the winners circle because I don't follow it.

[Stillriledup]

Didn't you read this?http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1rvkq83

Yikes.

[westny]

Didn't I just say in an earlier thread I don't follow Jacobson or NY racing? So to you answer your question NO ive never seen a Jacobson horse in the winners circle because I don't follow it.

Nothing like having an opinion based on nothing :D

[nijinski]

Pass The Tap finished 2nd today Aqueduct race 8 and was vanned off .
Getting out of control .

[Mineshaft]

and ran a horse in a stakes race today who I think ran about 10 days ago

[cj]

Pass The Tap finished 2nd today Aqueduct race 8 and was vanned off .
Getting out of control .

Getting? I've been posting about this guy for probably two years now. It has been out of hand for a long time. I posted this one over a year ago:

www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=99430

[nijinski]

Getting? I've been posting about this guy for probably two years now. It has been out of hand for a long time. I posted this one over a year ago:

www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=99430

Yes indeed you did . :ThmbUp:
One would think the right thing to do in light of all the recent dialogue
on social media would be to halt a bit . Stop your operation . take a long hard look at all parties involved , including the horses and regroup .
But I guess that would be the humane and normal thing to do .

[lamboguy]

when Penn National barred Mike Gill from entering horses, they didn't have shortages of entries.

[elhelmete]

Clearly, you have never seen a Jacobsen horse in the
winners circle". There are "50 owners" there. You seem to cling to the musguided belief "owners" in these cheap syndicates :eek: "make money". Likely, 90% don't. But they get a picture in the winners circle and "tell" everyone they "own" a race horse.

Sole owner's of million dollar race horses lose alot of money, and they race for 6 figures or more. How much money you think a 10% owner of a 20k claiming horse is going to "make"? $0

I hate seeing winners circles full of excited people.

[jk3521]

Only when I had the winner! :D

[Mineshaft]

Dan and Sheila just ran in the 3rd race for Jacobson

3rd start in 24 days for the horse.

[Robert Fischer]

Dan and Sheila just ran in the 3rd race for Jacobson

3rd start in 24 days for the horse.

Dan and Sheila's previous trainer Joseph G. Parker, ran the horse 3 times in 25days (July27- Aug 21st 2013 at Saratoga).

He also ran in a $52K purse today and went off 3rd betting choice.

I don't want to discourage good intentions, but there should be a focus on problematic practices if they are occurring.

[nijinski]

Dan and Sheila I hear , is now on the Vets list !