That Damn "Food-Stamp Socialist President"

[hcap]

http://www.salon.com/2013/10/11/6_absurd_right_wing_lies_about_food_stamps_partner/

6 absurd right-wing lies about food stamps
Perhaps the biggest myth? The financial assistance program is "growing exponentially" because of waste and fraud


Myth #1: Food stamps are “growing exponentially” because of waste and fraud.

Rep. Rick Crawford (R-AR) recently said, “Throughout the Obama presidency, we’ve seen the food stamp program grow exponentially because the government continues to turn a blind eye to a system fraught with abuse.”

Interestingly, a number of members of Congress disparage food stamps while receiving farm subsidies. Rep. Vicki Hartzler (R-MO) said, “This program is known for waste, fraud and abuse.” (Halter has received $516,000 in farm subsidies.) Kristi Noem (R-SD) said, “Loopholes and fraud …have led to federal spending on SNAP to increase 270%.” (Noem has received $503,000 in farm subsidies.) And Rep. Doug Lamalfa (R-CA) said that churches are more “accountable” at helping the poor than government. He said government has “failed” at helping the poor, so we should “retract” the program. (Lamalfa has received more than $1.7 million in farm subsidies.)
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And other conservatives call President Obama the “food stamp president” because the program has grown since the recession hit.

Actually, the SNAP (food stamp) program is doing exactly what it is supposed to do and what a democracy would ask of it. It is helping people who need the help.

Last March the Center for Budget and Policy Priorities (CBPP) responded to the charges that the program’s growth is out of control, reporting that:

SNAP has responded effectively to the recession.
The recent growth in SNAP spending is temporary.
SNAP reaches a high share of people who are eligible.
SNAP payment accuracy is at all-time highs.

(Click through to CBPP for comprehensive details.)

What about “fraud”? Implicit in the accusation that the program is “growing exponentially” is the idea that the program is rife with fraud and waste. But the fraud and waste rate in the SNAP program is less than 1 percent. The Department of Agriculture (USDA) administers the SNAP program. They say the fraud rate “has fallen significantly over the last two decades, from about 4 cents on the dollar in 1993 to about 1 cent in 2006-08 (most recent data available).”

Finally, the “error rate” which includes overpayments and payments to ineligible households is very low as well. According to Feeding America using USDA data, “SNAP error rates declined by 57% since FY2000, from 8.91% in FY2000 to a record low of 3.80% in FY2011.” Want to guess what the “compliance rate” with the IRS is? Last time they checked (2006) $450 billion was left uncollected because of non-compliance. In one year. But conservatives aren’t complaining about that.

Myth #2: Cutting food stamps will make people get jobs because able-bodied people are getting food stamps instead of working


Myth #3: Food stamps make people “dependent.”


Myth #4: Food stamps are about politicians “buying votes” with other people’s money.


Myth #5: Food stamp recipients take drugs.


Myth #6: People use food stamps to buy cigarettes and alcohol.



And so it goes. Righties are bonkers :cool: :cool:

[Clocker]

Same old same old.

tl;dr

[hcap]

tl;drWe elder gentlemen may not be familiar with them new-fangled idioms, but according to the Urban Dictionary this is literally, "Too long; didn't read" Said whenever a nerd makes a post that is too long to bother reading.

Yeah we older "nerds" rather link to facts that may be 100 times longer than your snide comments, and certainly more complex than your abbreviated political simplistic rightie crapola.

Anyway, sorry you found it difficult to keep up. :)

[Clocker]

We elder gentlemen may not be familiar with them new-fangled idioms,

What part of this new-fangled idiom was beyond your comprehension?
Same old same old.

[Boris]

And why should smoking pot exclude someone from getting food stamps, anyway?

What an incredibly stupid thing for the author to say. SNAP helps a lot of needy people, but I would think tax payers would expect better decisions from the recipients.

And it is not growing exponentially from fraud and waste, it is growing exponentially.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/8/88/SNAP_Benefits_Paid_2005-2012.png/350px-SNAP_Benefits_Paid_2005-2012.png

[hcap]

What part of this new-fangled idiom was beyond your comprehension?What part of your memory has forgotten endless rehashing of "Food Stamp President" here on the PA off topic by the Galt-an knee jerkers? If you wanna talk "Same old same old" look no further than the myths posted by your tedious political knee jerkers here about denying the poor and needy who really are not cheating or gaming the system as the Galt-ians claim incorrectly over and over again.

Why should I not not post a comprehensive debunking of such nonsense?

Sorry if you find it too difficult to keep up.

[Clocker]

Sorry if you find it too difficult to keep up.

"Same old same old'" means I've seen it all a dozen time before, here and elsewhere. To be fair, a lot of the people on the right are posting talking points too. But I have seen nothing from the left other than regurgitation of the holy writ. Listening to progressives preaching to the choir isn't a matter of keeping up, it is a matter to trying to stay awake. Which is hard when you have seen this movie many times before. I saw nary a hint of anything new in your link, so I skipped it.




http://fc01.deviantart.net/fs20/f/2007/231/4/a/TEAL_DEER_by_kunika.jpg

[Rise Over Run]

Myth #6: People use food stamps to buy cigarettes and alcohol.


I have seen, in person, someone use their "Families First" EBT Card in New Jersey to withdraw cash and subsequently use that cash to purchase cigarettes.

This is direct from the nj.gov website:

What is EBT?
EBT stands for Electronic Benefits Transfer. Through the Electronic Benefits Transfer System, the Division has created a "Families First" debit card that is utilized by WFNJ recipients to purchase food and to access cash benefits. EBT offers welfare recipients the experience of doing business like other consumers and is time- and cost-effective for merchants because it eliminates the use of food coupons. Moreover, the system has proven helpful in preventing fraud associated with food stamp trafficking.

Work First NJ TANF clients in every county are issued the Families First card to access cash assistance and food stamp benefits. Work First NJ GA clients receive these benefits via check.


So, is it still a myth or are you going to call me a liar?

[hcap]

And why should smoking pot exclude someone from getting food stamps, anyway?
What an incredibly stupid thing for the author to say. SNAP helps a lot of needy people, but I would think tax payers would expect better decisions from the recipients.

And it is not growing exponentially from fraud and waste, it is growing exponentially.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/8/88/SNAP_Benefits_Paid_2005-2012.png/350px-SNAP_Benefits_Paid_2005-2012.png


Pot? From the article....So a few more people on food stamps use some drugs than people not on food stamps. Does this warrant testing everyone? Or is it about further humiliating people who aren’t rich? And why should smoking pot exclude someone from getting food stamps, anyway?

So you propose drug tests for pot and other drugs? What about booze?

.............................................

At least your not parading out the myth costs are due to waste which is a theme among righties. To whit or 1/2 whit. :lol:
Rep. Rick Crawford (R-AR) recently said, “Throughout the Obama presidency, we’ve seen the food stamp program grow exponentially because the government continues to turn a blind eye to a system fraught with abuse.”

Your chart shows number of participants

But here is another.

http://www.cbpp.org/images/cms/7-23-10fa-f1.jpg
Participants have doubled, not risen exponentially. Exponentially implies to the power of an exponent.. Yes you can express a doubling by using the power of 2, but without specifying the complete series that is only true on the first iteration The second is up to 4x and so on.
And The number of people receiving SNAP increased in every state as a result of the recession. Some of the states that were hit hardest by the recession saw the largest caseload increases. For example Nevada, Florida, Idaho, and Utah, the four states with the greatest growth in the number of unemployed workers between 2007 and 2011, also had the greatest growth in the number of SNAP recipients. http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=3239

[fast4522]

I witnessed someone making a request for $80 worth of lobsters from Market Basket Supermarket. They will cook them per your order custom, they have the deli nest to fresh fish, anyway the jerk tried to pay in advance with food stamps. They rejected his order, he left the store in a huff cussing making his way to the front of the store and out.

[TJDave]

I have seen, in person, someone use their "Families First" EBT Card in New Jersey to withdraw cash and subsequently use that cash to purchase cigarettes.


In California EBT cards were found being used at casino ATM's. The State's solution was to prohibit the cards being used at casino ATM's. :rolleyes:

Most all of these abuses could be fixed using a little common sense...

which, government seems to be fresh out of.

[hcap]

I have seen, in person, someone use their "Families First" EBT Card in New Jersey to withdraw cash and subsequently use that cash to purchase cigarettes.

This is direct from the nj.gov website:

What is EBT?
EBT stands for Electronic Benefits Transfer. Through the Electronic Benefits Transfer System, the Division has created a "Families First" debit card that is utilized by WFNJ recipients to purchase food and to access cash benefits. EBT offers welfare recipients the experience of doing business like other consumers and is time- and cost-effective for merchants because it eliminates the use of food coupons. Moreover, the system has proven helpful in preventing fraud associated with food stamp trafficking.

Work First NJ TANF clients in every county are issued the Families First card to access cash assistance and food stamp benefits. Work First NJ GA clients receive these benefits via check.


So, is it still a myth or are you going to call me a liar?WorkFirst NJ (NJ's Temporary Assistance for Needy Families - TANF) is primarily a welfare program. These benefits include, but are not limited to: essential food, clothing, shelter and household furnishings; temporary rental assistance or back rent or mortgage payments; utility payments (such as heat, water, electric); transportation to search for housing; and moving expenses. In many cases the merchant is not following regulations, but in some states it is perfectly legal to do this with cash back. This is more comprehensive program than the majority of people who are just on snap., where purchases of cigarettes or booze is not allowed

Total number of Americans on welfare 12,800,000

Total number of Americans on food stamps 46,700,000

So the numbers cannot be overwhelming for chaeting this way on SNAP. And I do not agree unconditionally that this myth is iron clad wrong. But it cannot be as widespread as most think it is.

[Clocker]

The premise of the discussion is absurd. No rational person believes that those "myths" are entirely right or entirely wrong. They are all based on some element of truth. None of them comes close to explaining why the current "food stamp" program is approaching an unsustainable situation.

Even the term is nuts. Salon goes on at length with stupid arguments about food stamps and cigarettes, apparently in ignorance of the fact that food stamps have been largely replaced by EBT cards, and that such cards can be used to get cash from an ATM. The article is riddled with similar false information and fuzzy thinking.

Discussing that article is like rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

[hcap]

"Same old same old'" means I've seen it all a dozen time before, here and elsewhere. To be fair, a lot of the people on the right are posting talking points too. But I have seen nothing from the left other than regurgitation of the holy writ. Listening to progressives preaching to the choir isn't a matter of keeping up, it is a matter to trying to stay awake. Which is hard when you have seen this movie many times before. I saw nary a hint of anything new in your link, so I skipped it.


http://fc01.deviantart.net/fs20/f/2007/231/4/a/TEAL_DEER_by_kunika.jpg

Look, it is not a perfect rebuttal of common conservative myths, but it is pretty damn good.

[Rise Over Run]

So the numbers cannot be overwhelming for chaeting this way on SNAP. And I do not agree unconditionally that this myth is iron clad wrong. But it cannot be as widespread as most think it is.

PATHETIC backpedal. If you are going to make BOLD statements at least have the balls to stand up to what amounts to inconsequential criticism.

[sammy the sage]

WorkFirst NJ (NJ's Temporary Assistance for Needy Families - TANF) is primarily a welfare program. These benefits include, but are not limited to: essential food, clothing, shelter and household furnishings; temporary rental assistance or back rent or mortgage payments; utility payments (such as heat, water, electric); transportation to search for housing; and moving expenses. In many cases the merchant is not following regulations, but in some states it is perfectly legal to do this with cash back. This is more comprehensive program than the majority of people who are just on snap., where purchases of cigarettes or booze is not allowed

Total number of Americans on welfare 12,800,000

Total number of Americans on food stamps 46,700,000

So the numbers cannot be overwhelming for chaeting this way on SNAP. And I do not agree unconditionally that this myth is iron clad wrong. But it cannot be as widespread as most think it is.

So they can't buy food...how are they going to buy insurance or even pay THE penalty...??????????

[Rise Over Run]

So the numbers cannot be overwhelming for chaeting this way on SNAP. And I do not agree unconditionally that this myth is iron clad wrong. But it cannot be as widespread as most think it is.

You and your ilk are all about headlines and NOTHING about substance.

[hcap]

PATHETIC backpedal. If you are going to make BOLD statements at least have the balls to stand up to what amounts to inconsequential criticism.

....You and your ilk are all about headlines and NOTHING about substance.
You posted about TANF or welfare not Snap. You cheery picked in order to invalidate the entire program. More substance than what you posted and this is more to the point.

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=3239

Efforts to Curb Other SNAP Abuses Are Extensive and Effective

USDA has cut “trafficking” — the sale of SNAP benefits for cash, which violates federal law — by three-quarters over the past 15 years. Only 1 percent, or $1 in every $100 of SNAP benefits, is trafficked. USDA has also permanently disqualified thousands of retail stores from the program for not following federal requirements. In fiscal year 2012, USDA’s retailer fraud investigations resulted in 342 convictions and $57.7 million in recoveries. When cases of SNAP fraud are reported in the news, it is because the offenders have been caught, evidence that states and USDA are aggressively combating fraud.

In addition, SNAP now comes in the form of an electronic debit card –– like the ATM cards that most Americans carry in their wallets — which recipients can use in the supermarket checkout line only to purchase food. This has been a key tool to reduce trafficking. Sophisticated computer programs monitor SNAP transactions for patterns that may suggest abuse. Federal and state law enforcement agencies are then alerted and investigate. Retailers or SNAP recipients who defraud SNAP by trading their benefit cards for money or misrepresenting their circumstances face tough criminal penalties.

Yes on TANF/Snap comprehensions combined programs IN SOME STATES this can be a problem. But it is not the evil incarnate that you are implying.
Nor as widespread

[Tom]

#5 and # 6 are true.
Not all, but not none.
Another in the long line of off-the-wall wack-o posts trying to defend a a great failure.

I like it when you refer to "his ilk!" :lol:

[hcap]

http://www.cbo.gov/publication/43173

Spending and Participants as related to the recession

http://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/cbofiles/images/pubs-images/43xxx/Blog_SNAP_Figure1.png

[Clocker]

You posted about TANF

But you are forgetting about TANSTAAFL.

[hcap]

But you are forgetting about TANSTAAFL.I already know you want to shut down kids getting free school lunches. I haven't forgotten.

You going to join the other Galt-ians relocating to North Dakota like JR? You will not have to worry your self too much about feeding school kids after the move. I am sure there will be no government infested public schools to get pissed about. :)

[Clocker]

I already know you want to shut down kids getting free school lunches. I haven't forgotten.


It takes a strange twist of logic to get from TANSTAAFL (There ain't no such thing as a free lunch) to school lunches. Some people are just too literal minded. TANSTAAFL means there ain't no such thing as free health care. There ain't no such thing as low-cost college degrees for everyone. There ain't no such thing as low cost green energy. There ain't no such thing as expanding "food stamps" forever. Etc., etc., etc.

You going to join the other Galt-ians relocating to North Dakota like JR? You will not have to worry your self too much about feeding school kids after the move. I am sure there will be no government infested public schools to get pissed about.

Cheap trick to try to disclose the location. But not to worry, we will be taking children. Smart one for breeding stock and strong ones to work the fields and mines. And no government schools. Private sector only, vouchers as needed.

[Boris]

So you propose drug tests for pot and other drugs? What about booze?

I propose the Salon author is an idiot.


Exponentially implies to the power of an exponent.. Yes you can express a doubling by using the power of 2
Thanks for agreeing with me.


Your chart shows number of participants

The title on the chart is "SNAP Program Benefits Paid ($ Millions)".

[Clocker]

I propose the Salon author is an idiot.

He is definitely not the sharpest crayon in the box. He "debunks" the myth that food stamps make people dependent on the government (and no one claims that it makes all, or even most, recipients dependent) by saying that we are all dependent on the government for things like water and roads. I don't know where he lives, but I get a monthly bill for my water and sewage, and I pay for the roads I drive on through property taxes and federal gas taxes.

The government is dependent on me and others to fund its operations.

[HUSKER55]

I was in line at the market place the other day and watched a clerk give cash back on the food stamp card.


it happens all the time and everywhere and it is worse than anyone thinks.

buy your groceries and take the balance in cash.

[JustRalph]

I was in line at the market place the other day and watched a clerk give cash back on the food stamp card.


it happens all the time and everywhere and it is worse than anyone thinks.

buy your groceries and take the balance in cash.

In some states that is perfectly legal. Depends on the amount of change.

[HUSKER55]

you are correct. but I still think it is wrong thing to do.

[hcap]

It takes a strange twist of logic to get from TANSTAAFL (There ain't no such thing as a free lunch) to school lunches. Some people are just too literal minded. TANSTAAFL means there ain't no such thing as free health care. There ain't no such thing as low-cost college degrees for everyone. There ain't no such thing as low cost green energy. There ain't no such thing as expanding "food stamps" forever. Etc., etc., etc.
You going to join the other Galt-ians relocating to North Dakota like JR? You will not have to worry your self too much about feeding school kids after the move. I am sure there will be no government infested public schools to get pissed about.
Cheap trick to try to disclose the location. But not to worry, we will be taking children. Smart one for breeding stock and strong ones to work the fields and mines. And no government schools. Private sector only, vouchers as needed.As Tom says "There are lower cost and higher costs"
Like Single payer having lower costs than US health care systen(s) No one is talking about a free lunch economic system except those caught up in Ayn Rands' psycho babble. Makers and takers crapola should never play a part in deciding to give school kids free lunch. Free is as in the more wealthy pay for those who cannot afford it easily.

"Cheap trick to try to disclose the location" No, not cheap or a trick. Jr has already disclosed where the Galt-ians are going.

" Smart one for breeding stock and strong ones to work the fields and mines."

Fat ones for feast days?

[hcap]

So you propose drug tests for pot and other drugs? What about booze?

I propose the Salon author is an idiot.


Exponentially implies to the power of an exponent.. Yes you can express a doubling by using the power of 2Thanks for agreeing with me.
Your chart shows number of participants
The title on the chart is "SNAP Program Benefits Paid ($ Millions)".

......................................

Why are you ducking the issue on drug tests? I have seen no evidence that drug usage is rampant or SNAP monies in any great degree are going for drugs or alcohol. In fact, to-thirds of beneficiaries from the the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP) are children, elderly, or people with disabilities .

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/08/21/house-republicans-want-drug-tests-for-food-stamp-recipients-theres-no-good-reason-for-that/

Sure enough, SNAP recipients are somewhat more likely than others to use or misuse illicit substances. About 24 percent of SNAP recipients and 16 percent of those who don’t get SNAP have used at least one illicit substance in the past year. This drops to 13.1 percent for SNAP recipients and 7.5 percent for non-recipients if one excludes marijuana.

Note, however, that the actual prevalence of illicit substance use disorders remains quite low—only about 5.3 percent among SNAP recipients who are only about 1.7 percentage-points more likely to have such disorders than comparable non-recipients.

And if one excludes marijuana, then abuse or dependence of other illicit substances is rare within the SNAP population. By far the most common substance use disorders among SNAP recipients (and among the general population) arise from alcohol use—behaviors generally left undetected by drug-testing.

You cut of my sentence on exponents. No, I don't agree with you. A number doubling is not necessarily an exponential progression.One can show it is exponential if it belongs to a time series progression Which you can't. You use "exponential" as a scare tactic.
Example:
Observe how the graphs of exponential functions change based upon the values of a and b:
when a > 0 and the b is greater than 1, the graph will be increasing (growing).

For this example, each time x is increased by 1, y increases by a factor of 2.

http://www.regentsprep.org/regents/math/algebra/ae7/fixpic2.gif
So if you look at the decline in spending after 2012 as shown by the CBO, it clearly DOES NOT CONTINUE AS AN EXPONENTIAL SERIES!! Next chart Boris below..

Yes benefits paid. Sorry I am legally blind. But I also posted another chart (larger)that shows both and how the recession played a part.

http://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/cbofiles/images/pubs-images/43xxx/Blog_SNAP_Figure1.png

You will notice that costs doubled from just around the beginning of the recession to now, and MORE than doubled during the bush years..

[hcap]

He is definitely not the sharpest crayon in the box. He "debunks" the myth that food stamps make people dependent on the government (and no one claims that it makes all, or even most, recipients dependent) by saying that we are all dependent on the government for things like water and roads. I don't know where he lives, but I get a monthly bill for my water and sewage, and I pay for the roads I drive on through property taxes and federal gas taxes.

The government is dependent on me and others to fund its operations.The dependency of Obama phone receptionists, Obama social "low information" voters Democratic voters who leech off the government is a well known idiotic tactic used here on PA off topic. An undeniable philosophical view. A sign that you gentlemen are not thinking with a full deck. The initial excuse here for the pathetic ass whipping the repugs got with the "dynamic duo" candidates in 2012 was based on democratic stupid dependent voters were paid off by promises of even more "dependency"

For instance

"Carson went on to argue that the healthcare program “is slavery, in a way, because it is making all of us subservient to the government.” The bill was passed, he continued, not in order to improve America’s healthcare system or provide insurance to those who could not obtain it otherwise, but rather because “it was about control.”

You are in denial. That is the insanity that takes place. Pure and simple!

Give me a break! The whole makers and takers bullshit is a constant refrain here and out there in TeePeer lala land. You must think this board is squeaky clean.

Some one needs to wake and smell the coffee. :bang:

[Boris]

......................................

Why are you ducking the issue on drug tests?
I said I thought the author was stupid for including a sentence in the article. I made no comment on that issue, just the author. What I did say was "SNAP helps a lot of needy people, but I would think tax payers would expect better decisions from the recipients."

You cut of my sentence on exponents. No, I don't agree with you. A number doubling is not necessarily an exponential progression.One can show it is exponential if it belongs to a time series progression Which you can't. You use "exponential" as a scare tactic.

So if you look at the decline in spending after 2012 as shown by the CBO, it clearly DOES NOT CONTINUE AS AN EXPONENTIAL SERIES!!
OK. So the myth is they have grown exponentially from fraud and waste, and the fact is they have doubled in the first four years of Obama's presidency.


Yes benefits paid. Sorry I am legally blind. But I also posted another chart (larger)that shows both and how the recession played a part.

http://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/cbofiles/images/pubs-images/43xxx/Blog_SNAP_Figure1.png

You will notice that costs doubled from just around the beginning of the recession to now, and MORE than doubled during the bush years..
I was just correcting your mistake when commenting on the graph I posted.

And your chart was lovely. I'm glad to see the projections are for a decrease in benefits paid. I would expect they would drop in relation to the unemployment rate, but maybe not as unemployment has been dropping since 2011.
http://data.bls.gov/generated_files/graphics/latest_numbers_LNS14000000_2003_2013_all_period_M0 8_data.gif

[RunForTheRoses]

http://archive.lewrockwell.com/rep2/more-americans-on-food-stamps.html

[hcap]

And why should smoking pot exclude someone from getting food stamps, anyway?
What an incredibly stupid thing for the author to say. SNAP helps a lot of needy people, but I would think tax payers would expect better decisions from the recipients.
Pu-lease
You are full of it. The repugs, your boys, have already proposed drug tests. "House leaders are now proposing to cut $40 billion from SNAP over time. They also want to allow states to drug-test SNAP applicants. And here is an entire page of repugs jumping up and down on drug testing

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/tag/welfare-drug-testing
And more....
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/08/21/house-republicans-want-drug-tests-for-food-stamp-recipients-theres-no-good-reason-for-that/


So it was not an "incredibly stupid thing for the author to say", And judging by the outrage on this board and the slew of anecdotal tales about cash back on certain states welfare programs, it is something that conservatives exaggerate and cite much more than what the overall problem really is from that illegal use of that cash.
I was just correcting your mistake when commenting on the graph I posted.

And your chart was lovely. I'm glad to see the projections are for a decrease in benefits paid. I would expect they would drop in relation to the unemployment rate, but maybe not as unemployment has been dropping since 2011.
No, you were exaggerating SNAP growth by using "exponential growth" And repugs have said waste and fraud...Rep. Rick Crawford (R-AR) recently said, “Throughout the Obama presidency, we’ve seen the food stamp program grow exponentially because the government continues to turn a blind eye to a system fraught with abuse.” And I already complemented you for NOT using frad and waste as the problem. But other repugs have.

The costs are leveling off and you cannot pretend that it is exponential. Bush doubled SNAP costs in his second term, and the recession he caused had strong ramifications after leaving office.

[delayjf]

USDA has cut “trafficking” — the sale of SNAP benefits for cash, which violates federal law — by three-quarters over the past 15 years.

Yea, right. By allowing recipients to to use the EBT cards to withdraw cash, no need to sell your food stamps anymore. You haven't eliminated fraud, only made it easier. Here in CA they banned the ability to withdraw funds from ATMs in Casino's, strip joints etc. Big deal, I go to my local bank withdraw the funds THEN go to the casino.

When you consider that giving money to drug dealers directly funds the drug cartels - then yea I would favor drug testing for recipients. Seriously, What do you think the odds are of a drug addict using their food stamp money for drugs - I would say about 100%.

Your stats are bogus, the USDA may catch a few big fish here and there, but the millions of minnows get away all the time. There maybe big penalties if caught, but its so easy to get away with - practically nobody gets caught.

[fast4522]

bogus, you have him pegged.

[Robert Goren]

Yea, right. By allowing recipients to to use the EBT cards to withdraw cash, no need to sell your food stamps anymore. You haven't eliminated fraud, only made it easier. Here in CA they banned the ability to withdraw funds from ATMs in Casino's, strip joints etc. Big deal, I go to my local bank withdraw the funds THEN go to the casino.

When you consider that giving money to drug dealers directly funds the drug cartels - then yea I would favor drug testing for recipients. Seriously, What do you think the odds are of a drug addict using their food stamp money for drugs - I would say about 100%.

Your stats are bogus, the USDA may catch a few big fish here and there, but the millions of minnows get away all the time. There maybe big penalties if caught, but its so easy to get away with - practically nobody gets caught.Even if all that is true and you cut off families with kids, it will be the kids that suffer. If you want to remove the kids from those homes, you had better come up with a place to put them because the foster system is already bursting at the seams. You can talk all you want personal responsibility, but drug and other addicts are not going to be responsible parents no matter what you do and you still left with "what are you going to do with the kids?" The solution now is to give the parents something and hope some it slips down to the kids. The system stinks, but so far nobody has come up with a better idea of helping those kids who through no fault of theirs were born into bad homes.

[hcap]

Yea, right. By allowing recipients to to use the EBT cards to withdraw cash, no need to sell your food stamps anymore. You haven't eliminated fraud, only made it easierSo you believe fraud is rampant in the SNAP program. Any stats to substantiate these claims other than Fast agreeing with you?

Are you also backing up Rep. Rick Crawford (R-AR) who recently said, “Throughout the Obama presidency, we’ve seen the food stamp program grow exponentially because the government continues to turn a blind eye to a system fraught with abuse.” ? Same question. Any stats?

[hcap]

Just a reminder about cash benefits and SNAP

Electronic Benefit Transfer (EBT) is an electronic system that allows state welfare departments to issue benefits via a magnetically encoded payment card, used in the United States and the United Kingdom.[1]

Common benefits provided (in the United States) via EBT are typically of two general categories: food and cash benefits. Food benefits are federally authorized benefits that can be used only to purchase food and non-alcoholic beverages. Food benefits are distributed through the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP), formerly the Food Stamp Program. Cash benefits include state general assistance, Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF) benefits and refugee benefits.


So the big bad federal government is not as culpable for misuse as state governments.

[fast4522]

Treasury says the nation runs out of borrowing authority

Why should we borrow money for this. Our kids deserve better than to be stuck paying for stupid people of today.

[hcap]

Treasury says the nation runs out of borrowing authority

Why should we borrow money for this. Our kids deserve better than to be stuck paying for stupid people of today.I see your blowing tuba again. This time your singing along, bitching about all them stupid kids and people on SNAP.

[hcap]

Recent changes to federal law require states to prohibit the use of TANF EBT cards at liquor stores, casinos, adult entertainment and the like. States are supposed to have policies in place by Feb. 22, 2014.

There are two problems with this. First, the federal government leaves it up to the states to administer SNAP and TANF benefit programs and EBT systems. Second, it appears that individual EBT benefit accounts comingle SNAP and TANF benefits, and there does not appear to be any way to differentiate the type of benefit at the point of sale.

But obviously it's that socialist Obama's fault for redistributing wealth to all those freeloaders on welfare and food stamps, and stealing our children's future according to FAST :lol:

[Shemp Howard]

You and your ilk are all about headlines and NOTHING about substance.

They only live once.

[Robert Fischer]

Where do all these food stamps end up?

I'm not talking about what citizens are eligible, I'm talking about where does all that food stamp money get spent ?

[fast4522]

I posted this in another thread, not that there is no hungry in our world but . . .
And honestly wrapping ones mind around the following

Paul: There’s no reason to raise the debt ceiling

http://thehill.com/video/senate/326265-paul-theres-no-reason-to-raise-the-debt-ceiling

[MONEY]

I know a woman that paid Mexican Coyotes $4000.00 to bring her boyfriend that was recently deported back to Houston.

She paid with EBT cards that she bought at discount prices from welfare recipients.

I'm not against welfare or food stamps. I know & have known many people that could use all the help & more that they get/got.
Sadly I also know and have known just as many people that fraudulently get/got benefits.

[Robert Fischer]

Where do all these food stamps end up?

I'm not talking about what citizens are eligible, I'm talking about where does all that food stamp money get spent ?

A: the grocery monopoly

[Robert Fischer]

Create grocery monopoly
Expand food stamp eligibility
Everyone (80%+ ! of all food stamp recipients) spends foodstamps @ the grocery monopoly
Grocery Monopoly becomes leading employer.
Grocery Monopoly keeps wages/benefits low/nil ... in part because employees eligible for food stamp benefits
Politicians and Media conduct disinformation campaign to distract the public
Food stamps are presented as a "partisan" debate
The debate is full of vitriol inspiring slants that excite and distract the citizens from the fact that the food stamps are actually acting as a Subsidy for the Conglomerates who made the Grocery Monopoly.
Citizens buy into it.





:bang: Food Stamps are a subsidy for the conglomerates.



They skim money from your taxes , and they have you arguing amongst yourselves and blaming people on welfare.