Serena Evert,Graf,Martina?

[TheEdge07]

Serena wins her third US title at 31 years old unheard of these days..Is Serena the greatest female tennis player ever?
i have seen her up close at Saddlebrook in my opinipn she using hgh muscles on top of muscle..
Graf would be.my choice.

[wiffleball whizz]

Serena and its not even close

[cj]

Tough to compare different eras. Racquets are so much more powerful now it isn't funny. The game is completely different than it was even 15 years ago.

Serena hasn't dominated like some others have, but she has longevity. Graf benefited from the Seles stabbing. She almost assuredly wouldn't have 22 majors if not for that, probably several less. Seles was well on her way to being at or near the top of the all time majors list before that horrific event. She was dominating Graf at the time.

[Valuist]

In women's tennis, I like the OVA....as in Sharipova and Kournikova.

[JimG]

Graf, S.Williams, and Navratilova in no particular order.

Jim

[ronsmac]

Serena in a landslide. If not for her sister, she might have 20 or 25 grand slam wins.

[Marshall Bennett]

Serena without a doubt, but I'll always have my doubts about those massive legs she travels on.

[wiffleball whizz]

And to be honest Venus is 2nd all time behind her sister....those 2 are light years ahead of Graf seles king and whoever else...

[Relwob Owner]

And to be honest Venus is 2nd all time behind her sister....those 2 are light years ahead of Graf seles king and whoever else...

WW,

Check Venus's stats compared with Graf and Martina and you may change your mind. Venus is a very good player but her record doesn't really compare to theirs IMO

[cj]

And to be honest Venus is 2nd all time behind her sister....those 2 are light years ahead of Graf seles king and whoever else...

You are way off base here. The only way I think you can be fair in comparing across generations is by comparing how each dominated her competition. Venus only won two majors in the same year twice, in 2000-2001, and never won in Australia or France. I wouldn't put her in the top 5 of all time, let alone 2nd. She might not even be in my top 10, have to think about that one.

[ronsmac]

Venus' problem was being serena's sister. It cost her another 5 gr.slams easy. quite honestly she was more talented, but grew a little tired of the game.

[cj]

Venus' problem was being serena's sister. It cost her another 5 gr.slams easy. quite honestly she was more talented, but grew a little tired of the game.

Venus was better at the net, but that is about the only place she was more talented than Serena IMO.

[Ziggy]

Do they test for steroids in women's tennis ?

[JustRalph]

I don't know crap about tennis.

Chris Evert by a mile in the categories I care about :ThmbUp:

[Relwob Owner]

I don't know crap about tennis.

Chris Evert by a mile in the categories I care about :ThmbUp:

You got that right

[Marshall Bennett]

I don't know crap about tennis.

Chris Evert by a mile in the categories I care about :ThmbUp:
My favorite by far. Not sure another woman could volley better than Chris either. Will always believe she brought men's eyes to women's tennis.

[wiffleball whizz]

I don't know crap about tennis.

Chris Evert by a mile in the categories I care about :ThmbUp:

Heard she was smoking back in the day and she isn't bad now either!!!

In my opinion since I've been watching tennis since 1993...


1. Serena
2. Venus






Huge drop

3. Seles
4. Graf/clijsters
5. Novtana
6. Sharapova
7. Hingis
8. Davenport

Maybe I'm missing something.....what does cj think about this top 8 in last 20 years post Martina

[Relwob Owner]

Heard she was smoking back in the day and she isn't bad now either!!!

In my opinion since I've been watching tennis since 1993...


1. Serena
2. Venus






Huge drop

3. Seles
4. Graf/clijsters
5. Novtana
6. Sharapova
7. Hingis
8. Davenport

Maybe I'm missing something.....what does cj think about this top 8 in last 20 years post Martina

WW,

With respect to a Graf comparison, you are missing the fact that Graf won 22 Grand Slams, Venus 7.

[wiffleball whizz]

WW,

With respect to a Graf comparison, you are missing the fact that Graf won 22 Grand Slams, Venus 7.


At there peak Venus would be a -400 favorite against her


I liked steffi but she played a bunch of nobody's......Jana novotna davenport arancha Sanchez etc etc etc

It's comparing big brown to secretariat........

Also like tiger beating nobody's in majors.......what if he had jack lee and arnie in his fields........although I do think tiger would bury them in any era

[cj]

At there peak Venus would be a -400 favorite against her


I liked steffi but she played a bunch of nobody's......Jana novotna davenport arancha Sanchez etc etc etc

It's comparing big brown to secretariat........

Also like tiger beating nobody's in majors.......what if he had jack lee and arnie in his fields........although I do think tiger would bury them in any era

Again, you are comparing people using completely different equipment. Given equal footing, Graf would probably win more often than not against Venus. Could Nadal of today beat a 28 year old McEnroe? Not a chance in hell with a 1985 racquet, because he could never hit the ball like he does now with that. Just like McEnroe couldn't beat Nadal with today's tools. This is why it is best to compare accomplishments, not playing attributes which are largely a function of the equipment.

I agree with you that Seles was probably a better player than Graf. The stabbing ended that debate though. But to put Venus ahead of either of them is silly. Seles won more majors (playing against Graf!) in a few years than Venus won in her entire career. Venus has a LOT of really bad losses on her resume. You can't say that about Graf. She rarely lost matches against clearly inferior players, and even more true about Seles before the attack. She was a freaking machine.

Venus is one of the best grass court players ever, but that is about as far as I'll go with her. She was always pretty erratic and not nearly as fundamentally sound as the other top players. Her flaws were exposed away from the grass courts of Wimbledon. She was still really good of course, but second best? I don't see it.

[cj]

Also like tiger beating nobody's in majors.......what if he had jack lee and arnie in his fields........although I do think tiger would bury them in any era

Tiger was a great frontrunner, but he never had much heart. I'd take Jack over him every single time.

[cj]

Oh, and to have Davenport and Navotna on your list ahead of Henin is laughable. Henin won more slams than those two put together I'm sure, probably by at least 3 or 4.

[wiffleball whizz]

Again, you are comparing people using completely different equipment. Given equal footing, Graf would probably win more often than not against Venus. Could Nadal of today beat a 28 year old McEnroe? Not a chance in hell with a 1985 racquet, because he could never hit the ball like he does now with that. Just like McEnroe couldn't beat Nadal with today's tools. This is why it is best to compare accomplishments, not playing attributes which are largely a function of the equipment.

I agree with you that Seles was probably a better player than Graf. The stabbing ended that debate though. But to put Venus ahead of either of them is silly. Seles won more majors (playing against Graf!) in a few years than Venus won in her entire career. Venus has a LOT of really bad losses on her resume. You can't say that about Graf. She rarely lost matches against clearly inferior players, and even more true about Seles before the attack. She was a freaking machine.

Venus is one of the best grass court players ever, but that is about as far as I'll go with her. She was always pretty erratic and not nearly as fundamentally sound as the other top players. Her flaws were exposed away from the grass courts of Wimbledon. She was still really good of course, but second best? I don't see it.

I'll respect this post as it seems like you know a lot more then I do!!!!!!

Although I do like debating tennis......I guess this topic will come in January for the Aussienopen........only about 4 months away and time goes by real fast during football season

[wiffleball whizz]

Oh, and to have Davenport and Navotna on your list ahead of Henin is laughable. Henin won more slams than those two put together I'm sure, probably by at least 3 or 4.


Henin or Hingis? And as I said this wasn't a real thought out list,but should have figured there was a chance I would have gotten exxxxxxxxxxxxposed

[Relwob Owner]

At there peak Venus would be a -400 favorite against her


I liked steffi but she played a bunch of nobody's......Jana novotna davenport arancha Sanchez etc etc etc

It's comparing big brown to secretariat........

Also like tiger beating nobody's in majors.......what if he had jack lee and arnie in his fields........although I do think tiger would bury them in any era


WW,

Tough to compare different eras but to say Graf beat nobodies is way off the mark. She beat Evert, Seles and Navratilova to win some her titles. Other than her sister, which were great wins, who did Venus really beat who was all that good? Davenport? Henin? Good players but not even close to Evert, Navratilova or Seles IMO.

Oh well, agree to disagree on it

[cj]

Henin or Hingis? And as I said this wasn't a real thought out list,but should have figured there was a chance I would have gotten exxxxxxxxxxxxposed

Henin and Hingis for sure both won a few more than those two put together. Navotna only won one, and I think Davenport won three.

[ronsmac]

1. serena 2. venus 3. navratilova the rest not even worth mentioning with the top 3