80% can't read?

[JustRalph]

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2013/03/07/officials-80-percent-of-recent-nyc-high-school-graduates-cannot-read/

Officials: 80 Percent Of Recent NYC High School Graduates Cannot Read


A little hyperbole in the headline?

[johnhannibalsmith]

...


A little hyperbole in the headline?

No doubt... even better, the article itself bitching about illiteracy has at least two glaring misspellings just after skimming it... :lol:

[JustRalph]

No doubt... even better, the article itself bitching about illiteracy has at least two glaring misspellings just after skimming it... :lol:

Check out the comments :lol:

[Zydeco]

Check out the comments :lol:
even funnier,,,(is that spelled right?) I have a columbus ohio public school education so I am a little iffy...but I try. lol

[Marshall Bennett]

So what? Nearly 80% down here can't speak English. :bang:

[JustRalph]

even funnier,,,(is that spelled right?) I have a columbus ohio public school education so I am a little iffy...but I try. lol

Same here.......West High!

[Tom]

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2013/03/07/officials-80-percent-of-recent-nyc-high-school-graduates-cannot-read/

Officials: 80 Percent Of Recent NYC High School Graduates Cannot Read


A little hyperbole in the headline?

Then how will the know if they have a 32 ounce drink?

[soupan]

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2013/03/07/officials-80-percent-of-recent-nyc-high-school-graduates-cannot-read/

Officials: 80 Percent Of Recent NYC High School Graduates Cannot Read


A little hyperbole in the headline?

As someone who graduated from the NYC public school system and graduated from a NYC college I challenge this ridiculous article.

Tell you what Texas fool:

Would you be willing to bet your backass bank account on that 80% stat not being able to read? (like you posted) :lol:
50%?....,30%... :lol: :lol: You'll lose.

My sisters have children in the NYC public school system and I see the work they're doing and what they are learning.
Worry about yours and other backass redneck states and cities educating their kids properly, don't worry about NYC....and whatever you do, DON'T bet on those percentages above, you'll lose.

[johnhannibalsmith]

...Would you be willing to bet your backass bank account on that 80% stat not being able to read? (like you posted) ....

I guess you missed the part of his post that referenced the hyperbole in the headline.

[DJofSD]

What is not explicitely stated but is implied is the phrase "up to grade level."

So, it is not those students can not read but they can not read at a level expected of them when entering into the City University's system.

But you implicitly understood that, correct?

[Tom]

I think someone here just validated that article from the "Texas fool!"
:lol::lol::lol:

[soupan]

No I didn't miss the hyperbole.

It pisses me to no end how the right finger points at the education system in this country, especially going after the Dept. of Education.

I love seeing stats of how the US students lag behind countries in math and science, yet, it's our technologies that continue to lead the world and our Military applications are second to NONE.

That WILL NOT change in any of our lifetimes proving that the median results that right wingers love to cling and point to, like those in the article above, are ridiculous and lack relevance.

[johnhannibalsmith]

Okay. It seemed like Ralph was mocking the conclusion portrayed by the headline, since it wasn't exactly supported by the article in the way that the headline alluded to. I'm guessing it was more about the "sky is falling" reporting that has become the norm lately, especially in the context of sequester, than it was about how Ralph thinks education programs are so useless that 80% of graduates literally cannot read at all... as the headline seemed to imply.

[soupan]

I think someone here just validated that article from the "Texas fool!"
:lol::lol::lol:

So go ahead big shot, you love to bash the state you live in, why don't you open you yap and post a number of what percentage of NYC HS grads might not be up to Community College entry standards in math and reading.

Articles like the one above just attempt to skew the truth and provide Rush with something to help get through the day, especially after today's economic jobs data.

[BlueShoe]

Officials: 80 Percent Of Recent NYC High School Graduates Cannot Read
And if they bother to vote at all, which is iffy, 95-99% of them will vote Democratic. These are just the kind of people the Dimocrats are after and count on; ignorant dolts that vote themselves free stuff that they have neither earned or deserve. Just what will happen when Other People's Money finally runs out, is of course, something that we have debated in the past.

[badcompany]

As someone who graduated from the NYC public school system and graduated from a NYC college I challenge this ridiculous article.

Tell you what Texas fool:

Would you be willing to bet your backass bank account on that 80% stat not being able to read? (like you posted) :lol:
50%?....,30%... :lol: :lol: You'll lose.

My sisters have children in the NYC public school system and I see the work they're doing and what they are learning.
Worry about yours and other backass redneck states and cities educating their kids properly, don't worry about NYC....and whatever you do, DON'T bet on those percentages above, you'll lose.

You're right. Most of the kids who would otherwise contribute to that high number don't graduate.

http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/NY-GRADUATION-RATES-TRAGIC-FOR-BLACK-HISPANIC-BOYS-171043271.html

NY Graduation Rates for Black, Hispanic Boys Lowest in Nation

[JustRalph]

Okay. It seemed like Ralph was mocking the conclusion portrayed by the headline, since it wasn't exactly supported by the article in the way that the headline alluded to. I'm guessing it was more about the "sky is falling" reporting that has become the norm lately, especially in the context of sequester, than it was about how Ralph thinks education programs are so useless that 80% of graduates literally cannot read at all... as the headline seemed to imply.

Saved me some typing :ThmbUp:

[PaceAdvantage]

As someone who graduated from the NYC public school system and graduated from a NYC college I challenge this ridiculous article.

Tell you what Texas fool:

Would you be willing to bet your backass bank account on that 80% stat not being able to read? (like you posted) :lol:
50%?....,30%... :lol: :lol: You'll lose.

My sisters have children in the NYC public school system and I see the work they're doing and what they are learning.
Worry about yours and other backass redneck states and cities educating their kids properly, don't worry about NYC....and whatever you do, DON'T bet on those percentages above, you'll lose.Listen, I get it...you have your little shtick that you like to throw down here every now and then...get all tough and throw little words around like redneck and all that.

But if you don't tone it down (especially when you are UNPROVOKED, as was the case here), your shtick will come to an end.

[Tom]

So go ahead big shot, you love to bash the state you live in, why don't you open you yap and post a number of what percentage of NYC HS grads might not be up to Community College entry standards in math and reading.

Articles like the one above just attempt to skew the truth and provide Rush with something to help get through the day, especially after today's economic jobs data.

I think the graduation rate in Rochester is about 45%

http://www.whec.com/news/stories/s2651611.shtml
http://rochesterhomepage.net/fulltext?nxd_id=343812

This New York... we grows 'em dumb.

BUT.....

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20070426/NEWS01704260352/City-s-39-grad-rate-worst-Big-4


We have gone from 39% to 45% in 5 years - hcap calls that success. We fail 55% of the time, but we are a success!

[soupan]

Listen, I get it...you have your little shtick that you like to throw down here every now and then...get all tough and throw little words around like redneck and all that.

But if you don't tone it down (especially when you are UNPROVOKED, as was the case here), your shtick will come to an end.

Go right ahead and ban me from the site. You'll make it easier for you and your friends to play ring around the stupid.

Look at the responses to my post.

Especially BadCo's and Tom's last.

They CLEARLY shift the reality from "the public school system isn't educating kids" to "Inner city kids consistently fail and under perform."

My ENTIRE point in this thread is how the Dept of Ed, the unionized teachers and MOST public educators in my opinion, carry little blame in the seemingly failed public education system.
It's the CURRENT evolution of our society that's created the biggest problems in the education system.

Give you an example: My dad was the son of an immigrant, not unusual in his era, and not so unusual in many inner cities today. He was a bad kid, in and out of a bit of trouble, never finished high school. But the USA in his time was truly the land of opportunity, and if you got your act together and were willing to WORK HARD, you can earn a living, buy a home and raise a family.

Now look at the current situation in this country. We have college graduates who can't get work and getting into an Electrician's union or Plumbers apprenticeship is impossible if your're not connected. This is why many turn to the military, which in my opinion causes a whole new set of problems because our military is not a PRODUCTION industry and the cost are bourne by it's producers. It's all about being productive.

It's a different country today, and not, in my opinion, for the better.
I'm not laying blame. It is what it is. I don't have solutions.

But NO ONE should be suckered into the rhetoric that our educators are failing the country because if you want to compare the top 25% of "ours" vs the top 25% of "whoevers", I'll take ours.

[Mike at A+]

It's not so much the "educators" as it is the PC crowd who preach that everyone is equal in smarts (which they aren't). We're dumbing down the curriculum under the guise of unfairness to some (those who have failed to adjust to the real world). As for the bad educators (of which there are plenty), they get a pass known as tenure which allows bad teachers to continue to draw a salary while those who fail in the private sector have it very different. This is one huge example where unions have done more harm than good.

[Tom]

Especially BadCo's and Tom's last.

They CLEARLY shift the reality from "the public school system isn't educating kids" to "Inner city kids consistently fail and under perform."


You asked me for examples.
I gave you examples from just down the street.
Wassup wit dat?
You don't like reality?:lol::lol::lol:

[PaceAdvantage]

Go right ahead and ban me from the site. You'll make it easier for you and your friends to play ring around the stupid.

Look at the responses to my post.

Especially BadCo's and Tom's last.

They CLEARLY shift the reality from "the public school system isn't educating kids" to "Inner city kids consistently fail and under perform."

My ENTIRE point in this thread is how the Dept of Ed, the unionized teachers and MOST public educators in my opinion, carry little blame in the seemingly failed public education system.
It's the CURRENT evolution of our society that's created the biggest problems in the education system.

Give you an example: My dad was the son of an immigrant, not unusual in his era, and not so unusual in many inner cities today. He was a bad kid, in and out of a bit of trouble, never finished high school. But the USA in his time was truly the land of opportunity, and if you got your act together and were willing to WORK HARD, you can earn a living, buy a home and raise a family.

Now look at the current situation in this country. We have college graduates who can't get work and getting into an Electrician's union or Plumbers apprenticeship is impossible if your're not connected. This is why many turn to the military, which in my opinion causes a whole new set of problems because our military is not a PRODUCTION industry and the cost are bourne by it's producers. It's all about being productive.

It's a different country today, and not, in my opinion, for the better.
I'm not laying blame. It is what it is. I don't have solutions.

But NO ONE should be suckered into the rhetoric that our educators are failing the country because if you want to compare the top 25% of "ours" vs the top 25% of "whoevers", I'll take ours.See how much better your responses are when you subtract the unneccesary and unprovoked hostility?

[badcompany]

My ENTIRE point in this thread is how the Dept of Ed, the unionized teachers and MOST public educators in my opinion, carry little blame in the seemingly failed public education system.
It's the CURRENT evolution of our society that's created the biggest problems in the education system.


If you're talking about Government Programs which create single-parent households by making the father an unnecessary accessory, replacing him with the state, and also create a cycle of intergenerational dependency and poverty, I'm with you there.:cool:

[badcompany]

See how much better your responses are when you subtract the unneccesary and unprovoked hostility?

Apparently, you missed the first sentence where he called us stupid, for no reason other than that we disagree with him.

[johnhannibalsmith]

Apparently, you missed the first sentence where he called us stupid, for no reason other than that we disagree with him.

Well... I think that just makes him part of the majority here... :D

[badcompany]

Well... I think that just makes him part of the majority here... :D

Yeah, but that usually takes place after some back and forth. He starts in with the name calling right out of the gate.

[soupan]

It's not so much the "educators" as it is the PC crowd who preach that everyone is equal in smarts (which they aren't). We're dumbing down the curriculum under the guise of unfairness to some (those who have failed to adjust to the real world). As for the bad educators (of which there are plenty), they get a pass known as tenure which allows bad teachers to continue to draw a salary while those who fail in the private sector have it very different. This is one huge example where unions have done more harm than good.

I will pose this question to you (and everyone on PA, right or left) since you're so quick to blame the unions:

What percentage of teachers in public schools do you think get a "pass" because of tenure?
I know many, many teachers. The large percentage of whom have PRIDE and want the kids to do well. They often go well out of their way to help those that need it. (I actually tell some of them I think they're crazy to care as much as they do) I'd even go as far as saying that, in my opinion, the number of teachers (high school and lower) who truly care is much, much greater then the "tenure leaches" you suggest are rampant in the public system. I'm not denying they exist, just not nearly to the extent many right wingers suggest.

[DJofSD]

Watch This PBS Frontline (http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/education-of-michelle-rhee/) program about Michelle Rhee. Then get back to us.

[PaceAdvantage]

Apparently, you missed the first sentence where he called us stupid, for no reason other than that we disagree with him.Actually, I didn't miss it...

[Mike at A+]

I will pose this question to you (and everyone on PA, right or left) since you're so quick to blame the unions:

What percentage of teachers in public schools do you think get a "pass" because of tenure?
I know many, many teachers. The large percentage of whom have PRIDE and want the kids to do well. They often go well out of their way to help those that need it. (I actually tell some of them I think they're crazy to care as much as they do) I'd even go as far as saying that, in my opinion, the number of teachers (high school and lower) who truly care is much, much greater then the "tenure leaches" you suggest are rampant in the public system. I'm not denying they exist, just not nearly to the extent many right wingers suggest.
I don't recall using the word "rampant". But they DO exist and they ARE generally protected from termination by unions. I have three teachers in my own family and they too are sick of the notion that collective bargaining and unions in general are necessary for them to be rewarded according to their abilities and performance. They at least acknowledge that the "dead weight" holds them back from the rewards they deserve by "spreading the wealth" among those who are not deserving.

[boxcar]

I guess you missed the part of his post that referenced the hyperbole in the headline.

Maybe Soupy didn't understand the meaning of that big word. :D

Boxcar

[Tom]

My ENTIRE point in this thread is how the Dept of Ed, the unionized teachers and MOST public educators in my opinion, carry little blame in the seemingly failed public education system.

Bottom line, they continue to pass uneducated kids through the system.
At what point do they take a stand and start failing those that should be failed and sound the alarm?

[JustRalph]

Bottom line, they continue to pass uneducated kids through the system.
At what point do they take a stand and start failing those that should be failed and sound the alarm?

Failure was outlawed in the late 80's. when every kid started getting a Trophy for every sport.............no matter where they finished

[Tom]

The Simpson's mocked that idea last week - Bart got a "participation" trophy, and Lisa shows him the trophy she got for sitting in the bleechers!

Why in the world are people happy to institutionalize failure?

[DJofSD]

B/c it gives liberals more power and control. They don't want people to think or fend for themselves.

[badcompany]

Here's the dirty little secret that scares the hell out of the big government/union education establishment:

A big part of the classroom model is obsolete. Most of the teachers and especially the administrators aren't needed.


________________

How Free Online Courses Are Changing the Traditional Liberal Arts Education | PBS NewsHour | Jan. 8, 2013 | PBS‏

SEBASTIAN THRUN: And to our surprise, 160,000 students signed up. We managed to graduate 23,000 students at Stanford graduate-level quality in a specialized subject area called artificial intelligence, which means Peter and I taught more students than all the professors in the world combined in the same subject area.

SPENCER MICHELS: Were you amazed by this, or did you expect it?

SEBASTIAN THRUN: I was blown away, and it changed my life.


SEBASTIAN THRUN: We have some data on how it works. For some of the classes, we have shown that the average point score of students taking those classes online is higher, significantly higher than taking it in the classroom. That's kind of mind-blowing.


SEBASTIAN THRUN: It's not my lecturing that changes the student, but it's the student exercise. So our courses feel very much like video games, where you're being bombarded with exercise after exercise after exercise. That's very different from the way I teach at Stanford, where I'm much more in a lecturing mode.

Sebastian Thrun

Sebastian Burkhard Thrun is an educator, programmer, robotics developer and computer scientist from Germany. He is a Google VP and Fellow, and a part-time Research Professor of Computer Science at Stanford University.

[TJDave]

Bottom line, they continue to pass uneducated kids through the system.
At what point do they take a stand and start failing those that should be failed and sound the alarm?

I've spoken to educators about this. Parents don't want it and the system can't afford it. It's not like holding back these kids means they'll finally get it. They'll never get it. All that happens is the drain gets stopped up. Eventually they drop out.

[JustRalph]

http://ocw.mit.edu/index.htm

Little schools like this..........are doing it now

Some of my Favs in Political philosophy

Here's the dirty little secret that scares the hell out of the big government/union education establishment:

A big part of the classroom model is obsolete. Most of the teachers and especially the administrators aren't needed.


________________

How Free Online Courses Are Changing the Traditional Liberal Arts Education | PBS NewsHour | Jan. 8, 2013 | PBS‏

SEBASTIAN THRUN: And to our surprise, 160,000 students signed up. We managed to graduate 23,000 students at Stanford graduate-level quality in a specialized subject area called artificial intelligence, which means Peter and I taught more students than all the professors in the world combined in the same subject area.

SPENCER MICHELS: Were you amazed by this, or did you expect it?

SEBASTIAN THRUN: I was blown away, and it changed my life.


SEBASTIAN THRUN: We have some data on how it works. For some of the classes, we have shown that the average point score of students taking those classes online is higher, significantly higher than taking it in the classroom. That's kind of mind-blowing.


SEBASTIAN THRUN: It's not my lecturing that changes the student, but it's the student exercise. So our courses feel very much like video games, where you're being bombarded with exercise after exercise after exercise. That's very different from the way I teach at Stanford, where I'm much more in a lecturing mode.

Sebastian Thrun

Sebastian Burkhard Thrun is an educator, programmer, robotics developer and computer scientist from Germany. He is a Google VP and Fellow, and a part-time Research Professor of Computer Science at Stanford University.