Buddha

[penguinfan]

When are they gonna shut that circus down, anytime soon? What is the problem with your boys down there? I am getting tired of buying data files only to see them cancel AGAIN. Tell your boy Ted Arnault that the New Castle 3 are gonna come down and ask to speak with him:eek: If the tracks in Canada can manage to run then they should be able to straighten things out in good ole WVA. Lean on em a bit for me will ya.

Penguinfan

[JimG]

penguinfan,

Not to butt in, but most data suppliers will refund an order when the track cancels. I know Bris and TSN do anyhow. You may want to check that out if you haven't already.

JimG

[penguinfan]

Thanks JimG, you are welcome in my threads anytime, now if you can just get them to refund the 2 hours I spent looking over the card before they cancelled that would be great.

Penguinfan

[JimG]

Penguinfan,

I hear ya. I hate it when that happens myself.

JimG

[Buddha]

Yea, it i has been a rough winter. IMHO, i think the problem lies squarely on the head track maintence guy, and crew. While this has been a bad winter, it shouldnt have been this bad. A lot of the other winter tracks have stayed open. Yesterday, the track started to thaw a little, and had probably an inch or two of standing water, while the underside was still frozen, so it would have just been like running on an ice rink.

I question whether they will run all week. I think that it is going to continue this thaw/freeze cycle just about every day, with the way they are saying the temps and weather is going to be.

I don't understand a couple of this. First, how do tracks like AQU, PHA, BEU continue to run most of their days? They must be doing something right. The other thing I don't understand is why they don't run in the day during the winter. I realize they make more simo money during the night, but I think they would have a better shot of getting races in during the day. I know some of them horsemen have to be really struggling. At least the jockeys with sound money management should have some reserves, those horsemen still have trainer bills, feed bills, vet bills, etc to pay.

Also, there are going to be so many horses that get preference from being in a scratched card that they won't all be able to get into the races that htey already complain they can't get into.

A while ago I saw a article about how NYRA keeps their track runable during the winter. If I can find it, I will post it, but just wonder why MNR doesnt heed to the same advice :)

[BillW]

Buddha,

Do they shut down the casino on cancelled nights?

Bill

[melman]

LOL Bill now just remember there motto down at the Mountain "We'll keep the slots on for ya" Nice guys uh??

[BillW]

I'm thinking that if Mgmt. has the choice between shutting down racing for a night and generate more profits (at far less effort) vs. holding a card with all the risk and extra overhead involved, the decision is a no brainer. All they need is an excuse to appease the people requiring them to hold races as a condition for having the casino (horsemen, state horse racing board etc.).

Bill

[Buddha]

The casinos stay open :)

There is some requirements to the racing that they have to meet to keep the slots, but I don't know what all they are. Depending on how busy it is, they may close the trackside gaming rooms down, but they always leave the hotel side gaming rooms open as they are always busier and that is where htey get their money. Meanwhile, when they leave trackside open and have no racing, I am stuck with a very boring night of work, but at least getting paid for it.

[BillW]

I wonder what their record would be if the state required them to shut down the casino on cancelled nights of racing? :cool:

Bill

[Buddha]

I know that there isnt a lot made on the simulcast wagering, but I just wondering what the income reports will look like for the first quarter of 2004. they have only race 3 nights and 2 or 3 races of a 4th night.

[BillW]

If their supplemented purse structure is higher than the racing handle can support, it will probably look better. (i.e. because of the slots, the purses may be such that the racing operation runs at a loss as a stand-alone endeavor)

Bill

[PurplePower]

I think y'all are taking a one sided view of this situation. People and horses involved in the conduct of live racing put their future careers and sometimes even lives (see Michael Rowland at Turfway) at risk when weather - and subsequently track conditions - are bad. Maybe the track does benefit from a cancellation and maybe track maintenance is not doing all they can to prepare the surface - but sometimes the weather is just too bad for racing. I ran horses in Oklahoma the Winter of '89 (4 degrees, wind chill minus 46) because Equitrack didn't freeze (at least until it got snow on it and RP was told to "harrow the snow into the cushion" ). I had horses with respiratiory problems for 8 months after that, jockeys had angry looking bruises on their bodies and grooms had frost bitten fingers. Except that I want Buddah to stay employed - bored or not - so he can save up money for Saratoga in August - I think Mountaineer (and other tracks north of the Mason-Dixon) shouldn't even schedule racing in January and February until they build a "retractable roofed" racetrack.

[BillW]

Reid,

I don't intend in anyway to overlook the safety of the people and animals involved (Whick I wasn't very good at pointing out). If the jocks don't want to ride, call it immediately. What I was refering to was the night before/early cancellations.

Maybe this is a good thing about the casinos ... the jocks now have a more willing ally in Mgmt. when it comes to cancellation.

Bill


BTW about due for a visit, see you in the next few weeks. :cool:

[PurplePower]

I look forward to seeing you in my "glass booth" . Handle back up to the 2.5M range last couple of weeks with all the closures --and big payoffs are frequent -- just tuff to pick the horses that are going to make those payoffs.

[BillW]

Originally posted by PurplePower
I look forward to seeing you in my "glass booth" . Handle back up to the 2.5M range last couple of weeks with all the closures --and big payoffs are frequent -- just tuff to pick the horses that are going to make those payoffs.

Ahhh yes, Man who live in glass house :)

Been playing HOU lately. Lots of fun now that fields are back and some really impressive handles. I'll bet moving the Arabian race to #10 tonite will have a positive impact too .. nice move. They are always a momentum killer.

Bill

[Buddha]

Originally posted by PurplePower
I think y'all are taking a one sided view of this situation. People and horses involved in the conduct of live racing put their future careers and sometimes even lives (see Michael Rowland at Turfway) at risk when weather - and subsequently track conditions - are bad. Maybe the track does benefit from a cancellation and maybe track maintenance is not doing all they can to prepare the surface - but sometimes the weather is just too bad for racing. I ran horses in Oklahoma the Winter of '89 (4 degrees, wind chill minus 46) because Equitrack didn't freeze (at least until it got snow on it and RP was told to "harrow the snow into the cushion" ). I had horses with respiratiory problems for 8 months after that, jockeys had angry looking bruises on their bodies and grooms had frost bitten fingers. Except that I want Buddah to stay employed - bored or not - so he can save up money for Saratoga in August - I think Mountaineer (and other tracks north of the Mason-Dixon) shouldn't even schedule racing in January and February until they build a "retractable roofed" racetrack.

I never meant to put people in harms way, I just don't think that Mountaineer try's to their best to get the track raceable.

From what I have seen, and I know that I don't know a lot, but it just seems that the track maintenance guys could do better.

Also, I think it has to come to a point where Mountaineer stops thinking of simulcast handle, and races in the day during the winter to better the chances of actually getting to run the cards, as opposed to not running, and not getting any simulcast money.

Also as you mention the basically dome racetrack, I am surprised that hasnt been done to a "northern" racetrack that faces the winter racing. It just seems that you would never have to deal with the elements of muddy tracks, frozen tracks, etc.

Oh, and by the way, I WILL be at Saratoga, and right now I am looking at the 23rd-30th if all goes well.

[BillW]

Originally posted by Buddha

Oh, and by the way, I WILL be at Saratoga, and right now I am looking at the 23rd-30th if all goes well.

Sounds great Buddha ... already looking forward to it.

I can imagine the first astroturf oval (with scotchgard, hopefully:))

Bill

[penguinfan]

Originally posted by Buddha
I never meant to put people in harms way, I just don't think that Mountaineer try's to their best to get the track raceable.

This was my point from the word go.

[Buddha]

I am actually surprised, but glad they ran last night. I was told by a few horsemen that the track was worse than it was the night before that they had cancelled. I think that once they got running, that it wasnt as bad as they thought, and they finished the card, or they were too hungry and had to run.

Either way, I hope they can continue to run without many more cancellations.

[cj]

It is funny how times change. In the old days, nothing short of a blizzard stopped CharlesTown. I can recall watching many a race there only to stay in the hotel by the track afterwards because the weather was so bad it made driving back to Baltimore impossible. Now, they look for reasons to cancel. I can only imagine the new Waterford Park is the same way. :D

[JimG]

Originally posted by cjmilkowski
It is funny how times change. In the old days, nothing short of a blizzard stopped CharlesTown. I can recall watching many a race there only to stay in the hotel by the track afterwards because the weather was so bad it made driving back to Baltimore impossible. Now, they look for reasons to cancel. I can only imagine the new Waterford Park is the same way. :D

CJ,

Now tell the truth. You stayed at the Turf Motel next to the track because they played the replays of the nights races at midnight and you could hear Costy Caras say once again...it is neeeoooow pooost time.

In all seriousness, I remember CT in the same vein. 30 years ago they never cancelled due to weather as I recall. They had to run those 1250 claimers snow or not...hehe

JimG

[takeout]

Originally posted by cjmilkowski
It is funny how times change. In the old days, nothing short of a blizzard stopped CharlesTown.
How true. I was up there once, way back when, on a cold, windy, weekday winter night and it started to snow pretty hard before post time. I would've bet a paycheck that they were going to cancel. They ran all ten of them.

[cj]

Of coure it was the Turf Motel, was there any other? :D:D:D